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Democrats: Badly Out of the Mainstream on Israel

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A survey of opinion on the Middle East brings good news to Israel and bad news for Democrats. The Pew Center asked the question: “In the dispute between Israel and the Palestinians, who do you sympathize with?” Among every gender, every racial or religious group, every age or educational level, Americans strongly sided with Israelis.

Only one political group—self-identified Democrats—split nearly evenly between sympathies for Israel and the Palestinians—with 27 percent with the Jewish state, 26 percent for the Palestinians.

By contrast, Republicans backed Israel by a lopsided ratio of 13 to 1, while Independents favored the Jewish state by nearly 3 to 1. What puts Democrats so badly out of the mainstream?

In part, it’s the moral relativism that’s infected contemporary liberalism, leaving the left reluctant ever to say one side’s right and the other’s wrong. Moreover, Israelis and Americans share a reverence for three institutions many liberals instinctively distrust: the military, business and traditional faith.

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  1. Rizzo  •  Jan 30, 2018 at 7:42 pm

    This article just highlights how confused the left is. They can’t even clearly delineate simple truths like the differences between good and evil, and right and wrong. And, you can never discount the amount of anti-Semitic hate that lives in the Democratic Party. It has reared its ugly head more than a few times on this site.

    • Ty  •  Jan 31, 2018 at 1:04 am

      They can walk and chew gum at the same time. They can see the Palestinians as balkanized and filled with too many people that want to wipe Israel from the map, while also seeing that the Israelis are lying about being open and supportive of a two state solution.

      Bibi, and yes, even Michael Medved there LIES by omission when he pretends the Israelis are angels. Are they as bad as the Palestinian factions like Hamas? No. Congratulations, they are not as bad as literal murderous jackals. But they are not acting in good faith, they KNOW allowing ever increasing settlement expansion into contested territories will antagonize any potential partners for some future peace and two states. They also KNOW that it will be ever more difficult to demand land swaps with their own more right wing Israeli zealots dug into settlements as they engage in modern day Manifest Destiny to complete the Takeover of their Israeli homeland, a singular state, where the Palestinians are pushed out to the sea, or merely made to live in their ghettos and remain a permanent minority in Israel proper.

      That last is required for ISrael to survive, but it's still an ugly reality, there is a real element of ISrael being an ETHNO state, not to the point where no non Israelis are allowed to live there and have SOME rights. But the numbers matter in terms of how many Jews live in the nation compared to a place like the US, where (at least in principle) we don't GIVE a damn about anyones ethnicity (Trump and the nativist conservatives excluded).

      That is why, the American Model is VASTLY superior to the Israeli state. There is no codified elements of an ETHNO STATE build into United States dna. To our great credit. You cannot say that about Israel, your ethnicity and beliefs DO matter.

      INFERIOR.

      • Ty needs counseling  •  Feb 4, 2018 at 9:32 pm

        The Jews need what you call an "ethno-state." They need to have a place to flee from antisemitism. You just don't care about the safety of the Jewish people around the world.

        And there is an ETHNO built into the American state. It arose out of western European thought and continues under those cultural beliefs. It is in the constitution, the bill of rights, and the declaration of independence.

        Ty, you would be a much happier person if you let go of that sense of racial inferiority that you have. Tyrell Sr. did a number on you…

      • Ty  •  Feb 5, 2018 at 5:25 pm

        If the Israelis stopped paying attention to the ethnic makeup of their nation, along with the religious beliefs, they would be in trouble, and that is an awful situation to be in. So awful that just out of a sense of decency, to counteract that awful necessity, it would be useful to make credible shows of acting in good faith towards your neighbors like the Palestinians, EVEN IF they do not return the favor by and large. Because at least some of them are decent, and deserve better, and to have the door to some brighter future with self autonomy SHUT OFF because the Israeli right wants to clear out the contested area and make it almost nothing but a Jewish ethnic enclave is not something to be proud of.

        If you think it is, there is something wrong with you, not me.

      • Kevin M  •  Feb 17, 2018 at 1:40 pm

        Strange how "Palestinians" and other Arabs can live and work in peace within Israel and even hold seats in Parliament and enjoy a much higher standard of living than in the West Bank of Gaza who are obsessed with violence and antisemitism. I assume not all of them share the views of Hamas and Abas but obviously too many do. No Israel is not an "angel" nor has Medved ever said so and the settlements are a legitimate issue. But shoplifting and armed robbery are not equivalent. What happens whenever the Palestinians are offered peace including land swaps? They say no and resort to another violent Intifada because they don't actually have the slightest interest in peace. Can anyone explain how you have a "peace process" with someone that is pledged to your destruction, refuses to recognize your right to exist and teaches their children that you are pigs? I think Israel is expanding settlements because they got tires of waiting for "peace" a long time ago. The Palestinians made their bed long ago and are responsible for the plight they are in. Another great example of the "religion of peace" and tolerance right? There is far too much disinformation and historical revision of the Middle East to recount here but Bibi said it very simply: If the Palestinians lay down there arms they will have peace. If the Israelis lay down their arms they will have genocide. I think it's obvious which side has the moral upper hand.

    • Tru  •  Feb 15, 2018 at 8:50 pm

      "They can’t even clearly delineate simple truths like the differences between good and evil, and right and wrong."

      You are the epitome of the way that conservatives think. Of course, the definitions of what is good and what is even is always defined by ten. During much of the last century, Jews were defined as "evil" by much of the rest of the world, many of whom were right wing.

      • Tru  •  Feb 15, 2018 at 8:59 pm

        Rizzo opines

        "They can’t even clearly delineate simple truths like the differences between good and evil, and right and wrong."
        You are the epitome of the way that most conservatives think. Of course, the definitions of what is good and what is evil is always defined by them. During much of the last century, Jews were defined as "evil" by much of the rest of the world, many of whom were right wing. Up until recently, it was mainly conservatives who included gays, liberals, Muslims, atheists, and immigrants, legal or illegal, as "evil".

  2. Nani Tavares  •  Jan 31, 2018 at 5:20 pm

    I never did understand the effort of the Left to find moral equivalency between those who wish to destroy and those who want to be left in peace. My liberal colleague used to tell me that if Israel gave up the West Bank and offer a two state solution and that did not create peace, then the world would know that the fault lies with Palestine, NOT Israel.

    And so the world knows and still sit in moral judgement and come up with the same evil verdict

    Ty and others do not get it. When they side with Palestine, they reveal the corruption of their character not because Israel is perfect but because Palestine is so horrendously beyond redemption.

  3. Ty  •  Jan 31, 2018 at 8:37 pm

    "Palestine is so horrendously beyond redemption."

    And there it is. You let slip what probably a majority of Israelis believe at this point, and almost certainly most conservative Americans. Beyond redemption. Ok then. Stop pretending a two state solution is on the table anymore. Every single time such a thing is implied, it is a LIE. One state, ensuring a Jewish ethnic religious majority now and forever. Not JUST in accepted territory, but in ever expanding settlements in contested territory where Israelis were NOT living before, hence the word EXPANSION into those areas of more and more and more.

    Land swaps? What a joke. Over time those settlements will grow and grow making future concessions all but impossible to tolerate, but then that was the point. Just admit it. One state solution.

    The alternative was NOT as Liars on the right keep saying that we pretend the Palestinian factions were decent and noble, I don't think they would have gotten their sh*t together by now or even decaded from now. But the Israelis could have held back from massive expansions into contested territories as an act of good faith on their part. There is no more good faith. And they want to lie about it. As I have described before, the attitude now is basically…

    We won, you lost, eat DIRT and gtfo of OUR Jewish semi ethno state. That is what their ACTUAL POLICY and behavior shows, while Bibi lies for the camera and you conservatives eat it up. They are still stained by their behavior, not being AS BAD as the Palestinians is such a Low bar. Oh, congratulations, you do not toss your political enemies off buildings like HAMAS, BRAVO!

    That is your standard of comparison? What saints. If you conservatives did not have such LOW standards for your own behavior vs outside tribes, it would be easier to see this. But why bother, those people are beyond redemption, for all space and time.

    The sins of the father pass to the son, and on and on, this putrid ethic mascarading as righteousness. And yet another example of just how unchristian conservative evangelicals are.

    Beyond redemption, no matter what they do, how they might change. And Jesus said to God while dying on the cross, they are TOO far gone father, let them ALL burn in a lake of fire for all eternity.

    What is the difference between a liberal and conservative Christian? Take a liberal Christian, shrink their circle of concern, and for those outside that circle strip out most of the grace and mercy and capacity to be better than what you were.

    • Nani Tavares  •  Jan 31, 2018 at 9:14 pm

      Ty, keep proving me right. Ask yourself: what on earth would Palestine do if there was peace? Their GNP IS killing Jews. You can argue all you want, the proof should have been Palestinians STOPPING the killing. Honestly, this is NOT rocket science. This is like bullies complaining about not being able to play sports or suspended from school. How about STOP BULLYING.

      Can the Palestinians STOP killing Jews? Can we START there?

      Of course not, which is why your arguments have ZERO weight.

      • Ty  •  Jan 31, 2018 at 10:06 pm

        If they never stopped and changed, they would never get a state and stay stuck in some no man's land. That would be the position of an Israel that was serious about acting in good faith, even if the larger Palestinian did not. Israel would be on even higher ground. They have chosen to step down lower to clear their enemies out. That's fine, now let them admit it. Michael knows what I describe is true, Israelis know, but there is so much double speak and people playing hide the ball with their intentions.

      • Nani Tavares  •  Jan 31, 2018 at 10:35 pm

        Ty, once upon a time, there was a promise that a two state would end the killing. The west banks would end the killing. It's past time the Palestine showed that they are serious. STOP the killing. STOP trying to destroy Israel. Just try stopping and then they and you have got a point. Otherwise, you are wasting time with your Israeli hating. When Palestine refused to stop, they showed their true colors–and so did liberals.

        How tremendously sad…to be that morally bankrupt.

      • Rizzo  •  Feb 1, 2018 at 12:05 pm

        Oh, I get it Ty… so the 2-state solution represents some kind of failure of Israel?
        That makes sense…..

        MORON!

      • Ty  •  Feb 2, 2018 at 4:22 am

        Let me explain this again.

        Israel has a sovereign state, the Palestinians do not. That is the status quo, with less and less land available to potentially swap as settlements expand. Palestinians in this world do not give up the goal of destroying Israel and murdering Israelis, they never go beyond that and never get a state, but if they did, the contested land will be flooded by Israeli settlers, and there will be no carrot to go to beyond some infinitesimal scraps.

        Same scenario, with settlement expansions halted. Palestinians do not give up the goal of destroying Israel and murdering Israelis, they never get a sovereign state, but if they did give it up, there would be more contested land for THEM to settle in. There is more of a carrot.

        Israelis are removing all the contested land carrots, the stick is never being removed in either scenario, they will remain stateless until they change their attitude and policies. But I think conservative Israelis don't WANT any carrots offered, I think they want the Palestinians to leave the area and move to Jordan, Egypt, anywhere but near them. So why don't they just say that? Why do they have to lie? I get conservatives love being told lies, but I for one do not. Why pretend peace and two states is still on the table when it's clearly being sabotaged and cut off from a possibility even IF the incredibly unlikely event of the Palestinians getting their act together happened?

      • Nani Tavares  •  Feb 2, 2018 at 6:07 am

        Ty, you are SERIOUSLY demanding that Israel change their attitude toward those who want to destroy them? Did you expect America to change their attitude toward those who attacked her on 9/11? Are you one of those Liberals that placed the blame for the hatred of those that desire of those who want America not to exist on the attitude of Americans? Do you also make excuses for those that want us dead or/and under their law?

        Well of course you do. I forgot. You see nothing good in Americans and want our country destroyed. If she was good, they’d be no need for liberals.

        Rarely do I find someone so morally bankrupt and so much a waste of time.

    • Ty needs counseling  •  Feb 4, 2018 at 9:34 pm

      There can be a two state solution even if there are more settlements. There is a lot of land in the middle east that isn't being used very effectively.

    • Happylada  •  Feb 16, 2018 at 10:24 pm

      Funny you should be so disingenuous yourself, commenting as you do.

      Did you forget that Israel gave up almost half its after-war land mass as the price for peace – peace that has NEVER arrived?

      Do you NOT factor in that Israel has been attacked numerous times by those you think are so virtuous?

      Have you forgotten that Israel removed settlers from new settlements in a bid for peace?

      How can on even PRETEND to be a Christian and attack Israel's right to their own land, and peace and security in it?

      And YES, some cultures ARE past redemption. I hope you remember WHY God sent a worldwide flood – to remove a culture that was unredeemable. So then, since Israel has signed so many treaties with the Palestinians, not one of which was honored by the Palestinians, WHY should they NOT assume the next one will ALSO not be honored?

      The two nation alternative is on the table. One CANNOT blame Israel for settling the land that was theirs to begin with, granted to them post-war and conquered in a battle of self-defense.

      The Palestinians were given a homeland after WW2 – its called Jordain. They have no legal right to anything more.

      Do you NOT think that Israel is proper in settling the land GOD gave them before they went onto dispersion?

      Funny how you mix Christianity with leftist politics. While I am NOT a bigot, I see NO evidence that one can be a liberal AND a Christian any longer. Once it was possible. Those days are gone.

  4. Rizzo  •  Feb 2, 2018 at 7:58 am

    Nani… You are correct, when you state, "Rarely do I find someone so morally bankrupt and so much a waste of time." However, Ty is a useful foil.
    And while Ty can NOT, I have confidence that some leftists and would-be leftists, can learn. So please don't stop teaching the truth. I appreciate your efforts!

  5. Rizzo  •  Feb 2, 2018 at 11:11 am

    Hey Ty, moron… PopQuiz!
    Would you rather be Palestinian living in Israel or a Jew, living in Palestine?
    Which country is more free, tolerant and civilized?
    You damn leftists don’t know up from down.

    • Kevin M  •  Feb 17, 2018 at 1:46 pm

      bingo

  6. Jim Bird  •  Feb 3, 2018 at 11:47 am

    Ref: Memo Day

    So I’m driving from San Diego back to OC—do I dare turn on Michael’s show? There’s no way he can dismiss this corruption, rule of law, felonies. Wrong again. Paraphrasing ….. there are no crimes committed, Fox News is completely apoplectic over nothing, on and on. Do you know how to tell a “seminar” caller—they always justify themselves first as being Republicans. I listened for 90 minutes with an absolute flood of callers—100% Republican and 100% agreeing with Michael. He had a college professor guest at the top of the hour stating “anyone who listens to cable news seriously needs psychoanalysis” and of course Mike is laughing it up.

    I’ll tell you something Michael, the majority of the people in America are not stupid. We love this country and we will defend it. We will not give in to Marxists, fascists, thugs or totalitarians and we not chuckle and laugh when one Party tries to overthrow a Presidential election using the FBI and DOJ. We do not consider any this as a joke.

    • Ty  •  Feb 4, 2018 at 3:03 am

      Sometimes I wish I was scurvy enough to con marks like you with Trump University degrees. I could take in the cash if I was as dishonest and filled with lies as the bulk of conservative media.

      You think cable news is great to listen to? Of course you do, and I bet hannity is your favorite.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBGudMadlY0

      Capital shill, Truth? That story is not confirmed, fake news !!! how often have those LIBERALS been wrong ??!?!?

      back from break.. sources say.. ok maybe it was true, but so what right? He had good cause to have wanted to do it in the first place, look at this car crash, LOOK !!!!!!! Look Rubes, follow the yarn like a kitty cat, look at the laser pointer, follow it home !!!!!!!

      Ugh, how many millions could I make off you rubes. Unfortunately, I'm not that dishonest and that much of a liar. One of the handicaps of being a me.

      You are a walking definition of what is wrong with right wing media Jim, your head is so far stuck up your own hyper conservative ________ you can't see anything else, it's all filtered through those scat colored conservative glasses. Even Michael is a traitor to you, HE is the one who went off the rails.

      You lemmings would follow Trump into the gates of hell, while he used your fool bodies as stools to try to climb himself out of the pit. You used to favor law enforcement, now they are part of a conspiracy against Trump? Not that there is anything shady about Trump and his dealings or potential money laundering or whatever, no, that's all smoke and mirrors. Ok, you all have fun with that.

      • Ty needs counseling  •  Feb 4, 2018 at 9:37 pm

        There is that hate that we expect from you Ty. How do you live with such hatred? Tyrone Sr. really messed you up.

      • Ty  •  Feb 5, 2018 at 5:33 pm

        I hate identitarians, and the republican party and the right is filled with them. I have my own preferred identities too of course as a liberal, but it's a more cosmopolitan identity based less on living in a more racially and culturally homogeneous society and merely one where people buy into a larger American culture. The rest does not bother me as much as it does you. That's why I am not a supporter of the party that is trying to cut LEGAL immigration in half (see Tom Cottons proposal).

        I admit that I am usually not in a mood to persuade when I come here, it's to lash out at so much of the stupidity from the right I've had to listen to because of my mental disorder that impels me to go outside my thought bubbles.

        I feel like smug Bill Maher right here as he explains to conservatives why they do not need the wall.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAJUZRZBdlM#t=3m38s

      • Rizzo  •  Feb 5, 2018 at 6:16 pm

        Ty
        You ALWAYS WRONGLY ASSUME and assign underlying intentions to policies.
        The "larger American culture" and immigration policies promoted by Republican/Conservatives have NOTHING to do with being or creating a "racially and culturally homogeneous society", you simple-minded moron. However, the TOTAL OPPOSITE is true for leftists like you. You people are OBSESSED with race and skin-color and gender. Trump has recommended a merit-based immigration system… You morons promote a lottery. ABSOLUTELY THOUGHTLESS AND SENSELESS ANARCHY.

      • Ty needs counseling  •  Feb 25, 2018 at 12:35 am

        Ty, you are obsessed with race. Everything for you is about race. And you have an unconscious hatred for this country too.

        And what is your obsession with Tom Cotton wanting to cut legal immigration? I don't really see that as the silver bullet that you think it is. We have too much immigration. We should never have more than about 5% of the people living here who were not born Americans. I support pretty much ending legal and illegal immigration. Sorry that hurts you so much. And before you start your nonsensical name calling – I am married to a non-white immigrant. So spare me the sanctimonious BS about you "buy into a larger American culture." You don't buy into American culture at all. You have a strong hatred for American culture. That is why you want the country to be overrun with people who don't have American values and never will. That will make you feel at home because you hate this country.

    • Tru  •  Feb 15, 2018 at 9:10 pm

      We will not give in to Marxists, fascists, thugs or totalitarians

      Translation: We will not give in to anybody who doesn't share our point of view.

      Now we believe that our institutions like the free press, our intelligence and crime fighting agencies are corrupt because that's what Trump says and everybody knows he is always the paramount of truth and we are more than happy to let Him tell us what to think.

      • Ty needs counseling  •  Feb 25, 2018 at 12:38 am

        Weren't you spouting anti-antisemitism here a few columns ago?

        And it is hilarious that you are siding with marxists, fascists, thugs, and totalitarians.

  7. Rizzo  •  Feb 3, 2018 at 3:16 pm

    Jim…

    And, it’s because of precisely what you have described, why I do not listen anymore. Medved seems like a decent guy, but he is so totally off many times, that I can no longer tolerate it.
    I assume his audience consists of primarily undecided, fence-sitters. This is why I come here… to open their minds to true conservatism and expose them to what it TRULY means to be a REPUBLICAN.

    • Jim Bird  •  Feb 3, 2018 at 11:00 pm

      Thank you again Rizzo and Nani for your insight and clear thinking. Listening to Michael’s almost cliched and twisted remarks when it comes to the Democrats never ending attacks on the Constitution and rule of law, causes me to believe he is simply an ideological pacifist who doesn’t want to rock the DC swamp boat.

      His major concern, I feel, is to always give in to the Dems demands and to forget about felonies, Benghazi and the continued atrocities of the Left which are far too many to list here. His timidity about the Left is probably the belief that Trump won’t pardon Hillary (again) or Bill or Obama when they’re convicted felons. He thinks a Civil War and/or race riots will break out unless the GOP gives up, and as always with the Republican Party, to take the cowards way of appeasement to make everyone look good.

      I don’t know if Michael or his cohorts even read these comments or truly understands how badly the nation is divided, but if he thinks Americans are going to sit on their collective ass if nothing comes of these investigation (s), he’s wrong. Or if Trump has an accident that prevents him from fulfilling the duties of his office, I will bet there will be a Civil War and I bet Michael will blame like me for it.

    • Tru  •  Feb 15, 2018 at 9:11 pm

      I know, that's what's so scary about you all.

  8. Nani Tavares  •  Feb 3, 2018 at 5:10 pm

    Jim & Rizzo, have you noticed that the Left make HUGE deals out of everything but really big deals committed by them are shrugged? Why do Republicans just take a page out of the Liberal playbook and do the same. I think it is more the way in which we react that gives our side grief. For example, when they twisted what Trump said about Charleston and the 3rd world nations, Fox and the conservative media should have laughed and said "Pah-leez…drop the drama". It would have blown over in a day or two. Instead they are STILL talking about it as if it was proof that Trump is a racist.

    Sigh. The memo would have destroyed the GOP if they had paid for "the fruit of the poisonous tree". At the very least, the Mueller case would have been dropped. But I actually knew, nothing would come from it. After all, look at all the crimes that Obama and Clinton and Holden and Lynch got away with.

    • Ty  •  Feb 4, 2018 at 3:09 am

      Who wrote the memo.

      Hint, it was a republican who tipped off the administration, but no self serving statements there. No self serving omissions there, WE conservatives are ANGELS, we would never lie or misrepresent reality, only those LIBERALS on the left would do that, not us.

      Ok Jesus, what is the plural of jesus? Jesi? Jesuits? I'll just call you all saints of truth, or delusion, I'm not sure which.

      @Michael and all sane non feces throwing conservatives reading this. THIS is the legacy of conservative media. As bad as the liberal media may or may not be, as biased as you THINK it was, your media overall is FAR worse, it is loaded with conspiracy and even more bias, lies and deceit, and you see it in these manic responses. The peanut gallery will rail at these statements, pay them as much mind as you would a rabid dog foaming at the mouth on the ground. Let them foam, but pay attention to what radicalized them. That was not the left, we did not do that, take your own lessons to heart. YOU have your own agency, and much of the rot you see expressed in this zealots was forged on a diet of conservative media.

      • Rizzo  •  Feb 4, 2018 at 9:59 am

        "your media overall is FAR worse, it is loaded with conspiracy"
        Really?!?
        Your entire, leftist media-conspiracy, promoting this neo/pseudo red-scare, should frighten even you. Has there ever been in US history a larger group of politicians, and media, working together in harmony to take-down an elected president?
        Leftist ideas have been roundly rejected, and they can't handle it. So what do they do? They have been working since the first day after Trump was elected, to impeach him. If it weren't so GD nefarious, I would say it was pathetic.

      • Jim Bird  •  Feb 4, 2018 at 11:56 am

        Ty,
        How many strokes have you had?

  9. Rizzo  •  Feb 3, 2018 at 7:59 pm

    The Democrats and their media partners are trying to create a "red scare" that would make even Joe McCarthy blush.
    They are so obsessed with overturning the will of the people, there is no absurd depth to which they won't stoop.
    It is honestly the scariest, most aggressive abuse of power I have witnessed.
    – "Shall we expect some transatlantic military giant to step the ocean and crush us at a blow? Never! All the armies of Europe, Asia, and Africa combined, with all the treasure of the earth (our own excepted) in their military chest, with a Bonaparte for a commander, could not by force take a drink from the Ohio or make a track on the Blue Ridge in a trial of a thousand years. At what point then is the approach of danger to be expected? I answer. If it ever reach us it must spring up amongst us; it cannot come from abroad. If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide."

  10. Rizzo  •  Feb 4, 2018 at 10:20 pm

    Ty… Here is yet another PopQuiz for you. Hopefully, you are up to it.
    Can you name a time in your lifetime when:
    Dems weren't treated by the mainstream media, uniformly well?
    Or… to put it another way, have Dems ever been mistreated by the mainstream media?
    Are Dems ever forced to answer tough questions by the mainstream media?
    Has any president ever been treated like Trump by the mainstream media?
    Why does every mainstream media outlet cover every story uniformly the same?

    I don't expect a serious or thoughtful answer from you, but it's worth pondering.

  11. D F Schultz  •  Feb 16, 2018 at 6:05 pm

    For me it is a simple equation. What would prompt a "bloodbath" ?:
    – if the Israelies laid down their arms, or
    – if the Palestinians laid down their arms.
    Case closed.

  12. Jim  •  Feb 16, 2018 at 9:01 pm

    I am afraid I am no expert, I just know what I read. However, I do not believe the Palestinians want a two state solution. I think they want a one state with no Jews solution. That seems to me the reason the Gaza strip is being used to fire rockets at Israel and build tunnels to get terrorists into Israel. Their victim status would disappear if they had a 2 state solution so they do not want it to ever be realized. They get all the money funding for being stateless refugees. That is their motivation. They had half a dozen offers of two states from the Israelis and always rejected them. I think they will try to drag it on as is. They could have shown their willingness to live in peace with Israel by trying to make a success of the Gaza Strip. Instead they destroyed Israeli greenhouses, and spend lavishly on weapons, rockets, tunnels. They could build new businesses with the concrete they waste on tunnels. There just is no willingness to live in peace, and it would not change if there were no settlements. The West Bank is not really occupied territory, it is part of historical Israel. The Palestinians could have a huge state carved out of other countries like Jordan, and there are already many very similar Muslim ethnic groups living in Jordan and other countries. These groups are the same as the Palestinians in terms of religion and origins and mentality. Pakistan was not built in a traditional homeland of the Pakistanis, and it has been accepted. Perhaps the Palestinians should ask for a territory on Muslim occupied territory. Anyway it seems to me that they are not simply the victims of the evil Israelis, as many want to believe. I am no scholar, and you have read the same arguments lots of times, but that is what it seems like to me as a non-Jewish, non-expert observer.

  13. Mark Diehl  •  Feb 17, 2018 at 1:30 pm

    The Arabs only yell whenever Israel defends her interests not when the Palenstinians first attack Israels citizens or property. Why is that? I guess the Jews must be racist.

  14. RamsesII  •  Feb 22, 2018 at 4:39 pm

    White Jews get out of Israel……. original Jews was Black…… all

  15. RamsesII  •  Feb 22, 2018 at 4:43 pm

    The Evangelists put so much energy into obliterating any evidence of Christianity’s Gnostic and pagan sources one has to wonder what they were so afraid of. Edward Carpenter wrote: “…they took special pains to destroy the pagan records and so obliterate the evidence of their own dishonesty.” The Church ordered all the books of the Gnostic Basilides burned, the same for Porphyry’s thirty-six volumes. All the ancient lore that filled the Apollo library was lost when Pope Gregory VII had it burned to the ground. Understanding that they contained the doctrinal basis of the Gospels, Emperor Theodosius had 27,000 schools of the Mysteries papyrus rolls destroyed. For the very same reason, Ptolemy Philadelphus had 270,000 ancient documents destroyed. It was said that the baths of the early Christians were heated with the Ancient Wisdom.

    Perhaps the greatest crime the Crusaders committed was burning every book they could find, the original Hebrew scrolls among them. In 1233 twelve thousand volumes of the Talmud were burned along with the works of Maimonides. In 1244 eighteen thousand books of various kinds were destroyed. Draper reported that Cardinal Ximenes “…delivered to the flames in the square of Granada eighty thousand Arabic manuscripts.” In the New World, the Spanish Christians destroyed the lore of the native peoples and the temples that contained it.

    • Ty needs counseling  •  Feb 25, 2018 at 12:46 am

      Oh yes, Edward Carpenter. je je je. There is a real credible man.

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Michael Medved's History Store Also available on TuneIn